A lady asks, “You said that you had the vision of praying from the third heaven, so would the scripture for this be the weapons of our warfare are not carnal but mighty through God? Is there any place else where it talks about praying from the third heaven?”
Thurman answers her question. The scripture says that our rightful position in Christ is in heaven seated with him. He made those statements to us, but if we are not careful we miss them. Most Christians never see themselves in the third heaven. How can you go to the third heaven? You go by faith in the spirit realm. That is the only way you can go. So unless God were to translate you, like he has done with a few people, this is how it works. Paul even says was I in the body or not? I don’t know. All I know is that I was in the third heaven. The Lord caught him up there and let him see it and trained him while he was up there. He gave him all these awesome revelations. Then he sent him back. Paul tells us he was up there, but whether he was in the flesh or in the spirit he didn’t know. He didn’t even know. You see from this how confusing it can be. He did know that he was there and he saw it. You and I can go and do it in the spirit realm now as sons of God any time we want to.
When God gives somebody a revelation, he is giving even more people the revelation of this. Like Brother John says, that country he was in had people all over the place that learned how to catch themselves up into the third heaven.
An older woman says, “There are people who are healed and all, but you can feel the power. Just go out to about the fourth row and just leave. It is obviously a spirit of unbelief. Would it help to go through the church and bind that spirit of unbelief before we started our services?”
Thurman answers her. Oh yes, you bet. That definitely will help. In fact I had a preacher once tell me he went down to a foreign country. He had prayed. He had been down there 10 or 15 years. I believe he was a Baptist. He had 100 people in a city of 200,000. He was the only church in town. He was the only church there. He says that an evangelist came down there and he thought there ain’t no use in him going out there. I’ve been doing everything, been knocking on doors. This guy walked into town, set up a tent, that place filled up with people and he got 200 people saved every night. The preacher was awestruck. I heard what was happening, so I the preacher went down to one of his meetings. I sat back and listened to it. He got up there and preached the same things I preach. He preached salvation, but he did something I had never done. The man said he was going to give an invitation. Then the man stood up and said, “Satan, I kick you out of here in the name of Jesus. You will not blind the mind of anybody in this place. I know you are the one who blinds the minds of people, so Satan get out in Jesus name. Now Father, bring them into the kingdom.” People just headed to the front to get saved.
The preacher said he went back and preached that message with power and authority. He said, “I got ready to give the invitation. I gave the invitation and nobody came down. I said Lord what did I do wrong? “
The Lord said, “You didn’t take authority over the spirits.”
The preacher said, “That is right. Satan, I take authority over you and I kick you out in the name of Jesus. Now Lord, convict them all of sin and bring them down here. I gave the invitation and 15 people came down to receive the Lord Jesus Christ. That night. Boy did I learn a great revelation!” God gave us the information in the word. Satan blinded the minds. We don’t kick him out. We fail to realize that we, the body of Christ, have been given all power over the devil. You have got to talk to him and tell him what to do in the name of Jesus. When you do he goes away.
When you go to the scripture you do the same thing. You go to the scripture. You kick the devil out. You command him not to steal the word out of your mind or your heart. Then you ask the Father, in the name of Jesus, to lock the word of God that you study into your heart and mind so that you can hide it in there and so you can use it as weaponry against the devil for the kingdom of God. You will be absolutely awestruck at the scriptures you can start learning. They won’t go away. I have started putting the word of God in my heart and that is how I can stand up here and teach God’s word all day long and quote scriptures all day long and hardly ever need to go to the Bible for a reference. That is the way I did it. It is wonderful when you learn that.
The lady asks, “I have a question about the strategy of spiritual warfare. Do we deal with the heavenlies first or the powers and principalities on earth?”
Thurman answered her. If you really want to do serious warfare always go to the third heaven. Satan is out there in the second heaven. His spiritual wickedness is out there. If you catch yourself up to the third heaven, where you are above them, they are under your feet because you are in Christ in the third heaven. Then you can do effective spiritual warfare against them. When you tell Satan what to do and command him to tell his spirits of wickedness in the heavenlies what to do those are the generals and majors and so forth that are giving the power to the demons that are earth bound. Thus they are the ones you want to get through to. When you get through to the general, Satan himself, and you bind him up there in the third heaven, and you kick him out and give him orders, then he has to pass that on. He has to do this because you gave it to him in the presence of God. Satan has to be subject to you. Then you can break his power over your loved ones. You can start seeing people get saved that you could never get saved before. I have heard so many stories about this kind of thing.
I know there are only a few of us left and it is getting late, but I want to tell you this story. I had a Baptist preacher’s wife one night. I was teaching a Bible study. She said, “You know, I love the place I work, but so many people use profanity. I guess I am going to have to quit my job. I have asked them and asked them and they will not stop.”
I said, “Mam, let me tell you what to do. First of all you need to realize that those are demons in those human beings. Those demons who are using that profanity, they are not going to yield to you except they know you are a spiritual authority and you are using the name of Jesus to get it done.
She said, “What do I do?”
I said, “In the morning, when you wake up and get ready to go to work, read Luke 10:19-20 out loud. Then go to your work place. When you get to your work place, you go to the front door and look to make sure that nobody is within ear shot. Then you say, Satan I am serving notice on you. I am a daughter of the king and I am in control in this place and not you. I am taking authority over every demon who uses profanity. Demons you will not speak one single word of profanity in my hearing in this place today in Jesus name. I want you to know devil that I am a daughter of the king. You are going to do what I say because my savior is right here with me and he will make you obey what I say in the name of Jesus. Do this every day.”
Nine months later I was in another Bible study. Another little lady was asking a question about spiritual authority because she didn’t understand. This same Baptist preacher’s wife was there. She said, “Let me tell you what I did. I was in one of his teachings nine months ago. He told me to do something. I have done it every day. Do you know how much profanity I have heard in that place in the last nine months? I heard none! It has been so wonderful to learn that these are spirits doing this and I have been given all power and authority over them in the name of my Jesus. It changed my whole idea of the kingdom of God.” Isn’t that awesome? We don’t have to put up with the trash of the world. We are king’s children, but you and I as the church must inforce what God did for us on the cross 2000 years ago. Praise the Lord.
The woman now asks her question. “You answered one of my questions when you were praying for the brother. If you go up into the third heaven, can you go up there and ask for healing for yourself”
Thurman answered. Oh yes you can. Hebrews 4:16 says you have the authority to come into the third heaven boldly any time you want to.
Brother John Shares this. Over the years many people have come here with cancer. Breast cancer for the sisters has become very common. I found this and I want everybody to listen and pay attention.
Medical science does not pay attention to or evaluate pain. Sometimes people come in with no pain. If they have pain in their breasts, either pain or pressure, if that pain leaves then you know that your heart was open and the spirit, that life of cancer, left you by the power of God. You must believe it is done. You may have to tell people to go check themselves out in the bathroom. Some may say I still have that tumor. I feel it. It is nice to get rid of the pain. No, you got rid of the life of cancer. You must see it as a spirit of infirmity. You must not look at the tumor. You must look at what is behind the tumor, the life of the tumor.
Look in James chapter 2 verse 26. It tells you the body without the spirit is dead. That tumor without a spirit is dead. When the pain leaves it dies. It will fade away if you will continue to stick with it and say I am healed and believe that you are healed by the stripes of Jesus Christ.
Another man asks his question. “It sounds like the concept of the third heaven, which I never understood before; I understood coming boldly before the throne of grace was kind of an ethereal concept. It sounds like what we are told to do is to be instant in prayer even in these situations. Sometimes you don’t have time. You have to pray quick. In most situations, however, it sounds like we should be trying to get to the third heaven so as to maximize the authority that we have been given, making sure we are going from the top down in all these situations. I never thought of it. I am a babe in Christ, but I have tried putting some of these principles into action and I discovered just what you said. Satan ignores you. You kind of get the impression at such a time that Satan is just laughing at you because you are dealing with it on an earthly level. Now I do understand.
Thurman said this. You can get to the third heaven quickly because it only takes a thought to travel to the spirit realm. You can do this at the speed of thought. I take people to the spirit realm in a little bit slower way so that they can envision what they are doing. Technically speaking you can be driving down the road in your car and instantly be in the third heaven.
The same man speaks again. “When Jesus said don’t give your meat to the dogs, is there ever a time when we should discriminate? When we are up in the third heaven and asking for these things for our loved ones. Is it up to us to think, I don’t want to give my meat to the dogs in this case, or do we when we see a need just go ahead and go for it?”
Thurman replies to the man. I would pray for the souls of every human being. God loves everybody. Scripture clearly says that if there are any lost it is because the god of this world has blinded their minds to the gospel. It is not God’s will that any should perish, but that all should come to the knowledge of Christ. We know what his will is in the matter. It is the same for them as it is for you and me. He wanted all of us to come. Realize, like it says in Eph. 6, we fight not against flesh and blood. Anybody who is flesh and blood is not your enemy. Only Satan and his demons are your enemies.
But what do we do? We fight against people. We fight against people. We don’t realize it is the demon inside somebody that is the problem. When somebody comes against you with a furver you have your dukes up ready to knock them out. You instead should say wait a minute brother. Let me go home and do a little warfare praying and get you set free. We don’t do that. The first thing we don’t want to do is fight.
The first thing we don’t want to do is fight. Do you know why we had such a rapid winning of the gulf war the first time? There had never been as many churches and as many Christians praying as consistently as they did before that war started.
Learn how to pray in faith. It is amazing what you can do when you learn how to pray in faith. I taught the youth in my church about their spiritual authority providing you are walking holy, if God sends a judgment on our city, and he does at times, if you and your household are living in a holy manner and a tornado starts to come through town you will suffer the same consequences as everyone else unless you get out there and call God into remembrance and rebuke that thing. Say Lord, you promised in your word that these kinds of things would not come near us because we have made you our dwelling place. We had a tornado come through north Dallas, one of the mothers was headed home. She heard that the tornado was going to come through north Dallas, when she got home she looked screaming for her sons. They said mom what are you full of panic for?
She said son the tornado is coming this way. He said don’t you remember what pastor Thurman told us? We are living holy before God. He doesn’t have any claim for us. We have already stood out on the back porch and rebuked this thing. It isn’t going to hurt our block at all. That entire city block where those boys had rebuked the devil did not lose a tree branch. Things were torn up all around the area, but they in bold faith walked out on their back porch and said Satan you have no claim to us. We are sons of God. We claim the entire protection of this block. The holiness of those two boys claimed the protection of the entire block where they lived. You know there were people on that block who did not live holy before God. . God honored that. The entire block did not lose a tree branch. It is amazing what you can do in the name of Jesus.
Another man has a question. “On the Sid Roth program he had a doctor Martin on there who was advocating the taking of communion daily for healing purposes and properly discerning the body. He made this statement as a nutritionist, he said that the people are looking to vitamins and health foods for healing. He said it is nothing but idolatry. Do you have any feeling on that, that they are looking for those things to heal them instead of having their eyes on Christ?”
Thurman answers. I will agree that you should have your eyes on Christ. I will have to say that by faith nothing is impossible if you do everything in moderation. If you eat right, you can’t go out and eat Blue Bell ice cream morning, noon, and night and live a balanced life. That is just a fact. Your body requires certain things. You need to eat good things that the Lord put here; fruits, vegetables and so on and so forth. Eat right. Drink right. Don’t eat excessively. And if there are some minerals that are not in those things, but by faith you can call those things into existence, so do that.
God said in his word by faith nothing is impossible. We are the children of faith. When I eat whatever is set before me, I eat it in moderation. I always ask God’s blessing on it and for him to bless it to the full nourishment of my body. It will sustain my body for his glory for whatever he wants me to do. Thus I have a pretty decent body. I am about 170 pounds. I can do anything I want to do. I can run and play and work and do anything. I don’t take any vitamins. I never have taken any kind of vitamins. I am telling you by faith what you can do.
But I am going to tell you that the entire church does not walk in the health realm that I walk in. They don’t do it. And if they don’t do it then some people have to have something else to help sustain them. Not everybody is a full grown and mature Christian in faith. Brother John and myself have had the privilege to walk in things that the majority of the church has never even dreamed of. I am grateful for that. Aren’t you Brother John? I am grateful that the king has revealed those things to us. He and I are doing our best to teach and train the body of Christ what God’s word says. Now by faith the word of God says all things are possible for them that believe. If you have faith and knowledge of God’s word, and you call God into remembrance you can literally bring your granddaughter back from the dead.
Most Christians, perhaps more than 99% of them, if they had walked into that hospital room after losing their wife and their daughter that day. Their bodies are all torn to pieces from an accident. The two little girls are laying there with the doctors saying sorry sir it is over. They are dead. Most people would have just fallen to pieces. I did not. I took God’s word and said no. I will not receive that report. This is what God said. I am going to claim this and he is going to do it. And he did it! By faith what can you do? By faith you can do all things. That is what Jesus said, even though most people don’t believe it.
The other day there was a young man who came to me with a question. His question was about Daniel chapter 10, about Shaddrak, Meshack, and Abednego. He told me something and I said no sir. You are misinterpreting that scripture. He said no this is what it says. He said, “I have read six commentaries on this chapter and every one of those men agree with what I am saying.” I said sir I hate to tell you this, but you and those six commentators are wrong. He kept it up saying we can’t all be wrong. I said I was going to guarantee you that you are wrong. You misinterpreted the scripture.
This is what it says. I took him through it and showed it to him. I don’t think I ever did convince him totally.
One week later I was on my way to Sanintone to minister to a woman. I had two men with me. I asked this very young man, a 22-year-old who hears from God really quick, so I asked him to do this. “Son read Daniel 10 and I want you to tell me what certain verses say to you.” He started reading. He read them out loud. Then I said, “What did they say?” He told me and I said, “The first part is right. Now what does the second part say?” He said something and I said, “No that is not right.”
He said, “Brother Thurman that is what it says.”
I said, “No you misinterpreted that. Read it again.” He read it again. He again said that he had it right. I said, “No, you are wrong. No scripture is open to a private interpretation. Ask the Father in the name of Jesus to give you a revelation of that scripture.”
He said, “Father in Jesus name tell me what that says.” Then he said, “Thurman it says this.”
I said, “That is exactly it.” The instant he ask the Father he gave him revelation on that verse and he got it just like that. It is amazing how different people read God’s word and say this is what it says, but that is not what it says. It is so easy to misinterpret God’s word. No scripture is of private interpretation. That is why, as you read the word of God in the Holy Spirit, that is the only way to get it.
You can listen to all kinds of people, all kinds of radio programs and everything else; but you have to be very careful what they say. Just like Brother John said a while ago, Don’t do anything without going to God and asking him Lord, is this what you mean? If you stay with him, he will give you an answer.
As far as taking communion every day, I don’t have a problem with that at all. If a man wants to take communion every day then so be it. There are some Sundays where I take communion at one church and then take it again at another church, two times in the same day. I really think there is healing power in communion. I really think there is great power in communion.
I have used that verse several times for myself. The first time I used Mark 16:18, no deadly poison shall hurt you, I was out in my field. I was building fence post. I had an anchor on a corner post and I had trenched through a huge fire ant bed. Some of you may not know what fire ants are. They are a little tiny black ant, that when it stings you it leaves a whelp on you about 10 times as big as his body. They have fire in them. They are everywhere down there now. They are all over. Whenever two or three of them gets on you it will just set your hand on fire. But if you get into a bed of them things you are in trouble. They have been known to cause cardiac arrest. They are that powerful.
I was down in a hole one day, cleaning out the hole, as I had trenched through one of these beds. There were thousands and thousands of these things down there. I didn’t see them in this black dirt. All of a sudden I am on fire. When I groped out of the hole and looked, I was covered. Everywhere I could see there were fire ants. My face was just burning like gasoline had been poured on me, and my neck and everything. I knew they were all over me. They all stung at the same time.
I jumped up out of that hole. I grabbed my right glove off and threw it down and said Father! In the name of Jesus, you said in Mark chapter 16:18 no deadly poison shall hurt me. Father, in Jesus name I claim that right now. Instantly, in one heart beat, every ant was blown off me and was completely gone. I never had one whelp on my body, not even one. Yes that works. By faith nothing is impossible. All you need to do is find a promise in God’s word that will fit the circumstances you need at the time and claim that promise.
The Lord told us in 2Peter:1 I have given you exceeding and great promises that through the knowledge of them you might become partakers of the divine nature of God. Everything is yours. He didn’t leave out anything. You don’t need anything. He has given you what you need. All you need to do is claim it. It is already there in Jesus name. It is so wonderful when you begin to get the scripture in you. It is awesome.
Note: A lady with a heavy accent is giving a testimony. I cannot understand some of what she is saying. Thus her testimony is not in this transcript. The audio gets a little better by the time she gets to her other statements after her testimony.
This lady speaks. “In my experience, one time my spirit was outside of my body while I was praying and I saw some heaven. The other one is when I sing by the Holy Spirit and when I play by the Holy Spirit I see the angels dancing and singing. I see the living water running. I feel these things.
My daughter passed away last year. She went to heaven and I was in grief. The Lord gave me lots of heavenly music that I could sing from my mouth. I saw my daughter dancing with a white robe. Is this the third heaven or what?”
Thurman replies to her. In the third heaven we have these white robes.
The lady continues, “I had this feeling even when I was driving in the car, so I was wondering what this was.”
Thurman continues to answer her. You are absolutely right. Praise the Lord. Praise the Lord. Praise the Lord. That goes to prove who the healer is. All she did was come expecting and Jesus showed up. Nobody even got to pray for her. Jesus took care of her. Guess who gets all the glory in this kind of thing? God does. Praise the Lord. Praise the Lord.
This woman asks her question. “I know God is the healer of everything. He created man. He also instituted doctors, so what role do they have in this world? They must have some role. They deliver babies. I wouldn’t deliver myself.”
Thurman answers her question. Technically speaking, we didn’t have doctors to deliver babies until the last couple of hundred years. Before that the ladies did it themselves.
Now then, today I want you to know something. I am totally against when you go as a family, when you have a child, you go to the doctor and they start doing all these things. Then the minute the baby is born the poor little guy, the first thing they do if he is a boy is circumcise him on the first day. That is suppose to be done on the eighth day. Then immediately they stick a needle in his heal to make him bleed, in order to get his blood for a sample. I am totally against this. I think babies still aught to be born at home with God. We need to learn to trust God for everything. I am going to tell you that if you trust God for everything, God will show up and he will perform everything. You won’t have to give all your money to those doctors. Since Brother John and I have learned this, we teach it.
I had a lady in my church for 33 years. She walked in divine health for 33 years. A couple of weeks ago the devil tried to come upon her and kill her. She is an elderly lady. He was putting a symptom on her and putting a tremendous angina heart pain on her. She came to the healing school and was going to come down and interrupt and have me pray for her because she was hurting so bad. The Lord spoke to her and told her, 33 years ago you accepted me as your healer. Was that settled or not? She said yes it was. He said then you don’t need Thurman to pray for you. She said alright Lord. I will just get up and go outside. I will take your name and I will take care of this myself in the name of Jesus
I started to get up to go outside and the minute I started to go outside the devil left. The pain left. She never even had to rebuke him. On Sunday she gave this testimony at our church. She said I have not had another pain since them. See, the enemy was coming upon her, putting a symptom upon her, trying to get her to yield with her tongue so he could kill her. The minute she yields with her tongue she loses it and the devil has legal right. Then he brings a heart attack upon her and kills her.